Clause 47 - Indecent photographs of persons aged 16 or 17

Part of Sexual Offences Bill [Lords] – in a Public Bill Committee am 9:10 pm ar 18 Medi 2003.

Danfonwch hysbysiad imi am ddadleuon fel hyn

Photo of Beverley Hughes Beverley Hughes Minister of State (Citizenship and Immigration), Home Office, Minister of State (Home Office) (Citizenship, Immigration and Counter-Terrorism) 9:10, 18 Medi 2003

I could answer that last question very simply: the hon. Gentleman may think that we are making heavy weather of the clause and making things excessively complicated, but that is because life itself is complicated. We are trying to weave a way through—a phrase that he used—the competing imperatives with which we are grappling. We are trying to find satisfactory protection from exploitation for people under 18, while acknowledging that over-16s can consent to sexual activity and can marry. We want to accommodate the competing imperatives of protecting the privacy of a marital or enduring relationship and of ensuring the maximum protection for children and young people.

Amendments Nos. 231 and 232 would remove completely the exceptions provided in subsections (3) and (4), which permit the taking, making and possession of an indecent photograph of a child over 16 with the consent of that child; they also include its distribution to the child. The amendments do not replace those exceptions. The hon. Member for Romsey believes that no exceptions are appropriate—she has made that clear. We believe that some limited exceptions are appropriate, but we accept that the current drafting of the clause is flawed, which is why we have tabled Government amendment No. 91.

Clause 47 raises the bar on indecent photographs and pseudo-photographs of children—by inserting new provisions into the Protection of Children Act 1978 and the Criminal Justice Act 1988—to include those depicting children aged 16 and 17. That is in line with our international obligations to ensure that there is protection for children up to 18 from exploitation through pornography. We think that it is right to exclude from the offences those persons who are living in an enduring family relationship with or who are married to the child of that age who is depicted in the photograph.

The wording of the clause as it is drafted does not achieve that objective. It has become clear—after debate and consideration—that it might allow a person who is not in such a relationship to take or possess an indecent photograph of a child, albeit with the child's consent. It is also defective in that it does not protect a person who possesses an indecent photograph of his 16 or 17-year-old partner, unless he took that photograph. That is why we tabled Government amendment No. 91, which makes the establishment of the relationship the core—the central feature—of the exception.

I shall get to the point raised by the hon. Member for Beaconsfield (Mr. Grieve) in a moment. I am confident that the amendment will allow persons in a marriage or other enduring relationship to take, make, possess, or show to each other indecent photographs of one another, if they wish to, without fear of prosecution. I have checked with officials to ensure that that does not allow a loophole for anybody else to be involved in any other way. The exception will cover a person who can prove that he was living as a partner in an enduring family relationship with or married to the child aged 16 or over in the photograph. In no case

may any person other than the child or the partner be in the photograph, nor may it be distributed to any person outside that relationship—and no other person may involved in the taking or making of the photograph.