To ask the Secretary of State for Social Security what proportion of pensioners have income from occupational pensions or savings; and what was the comparable position in 1979.

We estimate that in 1988, 82 per cent. of pensioners had income from either savings or from an occupational pension, compared with only 73 per cent. in 1979.

Does not that figure give added weight to the point made by my hon. Friend the Under-Secretary of State a few moments ago—that the best interests of pensioners are served by directing additional resources to those who rely entirely on the state pension, rather than on a general increase in pension benefits? Does not it also suggest that the best interests of pensioners as a whole are served by maintaining a stable economic climate and a low rate of inflation?

I entirely agree with the second point. As for the first, it is to assist those who are least well-off that we have focused additional resources on increasing pensioners' income support premiums in the past two or three years.

Does the Secretary of State agree that there is a difference between the pension arrangements for Members of Parliament and directors of privatised industries, who give themselves vast pay increases on which their pensions will be based, and those for people who have only just entered schemes and will therefore receive very little?

Will the right hon. Gentleman assure the House that all this talk of income from savings and pension schemes will not interefere with state benefits or with the annual increase in those benefits?

We have made it absolutely clear that, having fully and faithfully—a phrase which I have used before—uprated the basic state retirement pension throughout our period in office, we intend to continue to do so. I have always acknowledged that, although a growing number of pensioners have extra income of various kinds, a good many still have no such income. That is why we have increased income support premiums: we want to direct additional help to those people.

Will my right hon. Friend confirm, in the light of his answer, that now that more than 80 per cent. of pensioners receive additional income it is essential at times to talk of average earnings, rather than only of state pensions, as Opposition Members often do? That applies particularly to comparisons with other European countries.

I agree, but I know that my hon. Friend will accept that we should always remember that averages are averages and that they conceal the fact that some people receive less than the average. We should bear those people in mind.