Orders of the Day — Northern Ireland Constitution (Amendment) Bill

Part of the debate – in the House of Commons am 12:00 am ar 13 Rhagfyr 1973.

Danfonwch hysbysiad imi am ddadleuon fel hyn

Photo of Mr Francis Pym Mr Francis Pym , Cambridgeshire 12:00, 13 Rhagfyr 1973

I will come to that.

The Bill is, therefore, mainly a technical exercise. It does not seek to deal with any of the fundamental principles set out in the Constitution Act—indeed these principles are the very ones upon which the discussions and negotiations of the past few months have proceeded.

Perhaps at this point it would be appropriate for me to say a word about the orders that we are also debating at the same time.

The Northern Ireland Constitution (Devolution) Order provides for the date upon which the main provisions of the Northern Ireland Constitution Act 1973 come into operation. From that date the Northern Ireland Assembly will be able to pass legislation on the matters transferred to it—the devolution order specifies what these matters are to be—and from the same date the Northern Ireland Executive will assume executive responsibility in Northern Ireland for the very wide range of government functions assigned to it.

Before introducing the order, the Secretary of State is required to be satisfied that the Northern Ireland Assembly has made satisfactory provision by its standing orders for the provisions mentioned in Section 25 of the Constitution Act. As my predecessor told the House on 22nd November, he was satisfied that this minimum provision had been made. I should perhaps say that all that the Secretary of State is required to do under the Act is to be satisfied that the standing orders make suitable provision for consultative committees and other procedure matters referred to in Sections 25(2) to (5). There are, of course, other and more controversial matters in the standing orders, but the Secretary of State has no need for the purposes of Section 2 to take a view on these matters.

In addition, the Secretary of State is required to be satisfied that a Northern Ireland Executive can be formed which, having regard to the support it commands in the Assembly and to the electorate upon which that support is based, is likely to be widely accepted throughout the community. The House already knows that it is the Government's view that this requirement is also met. The point was discussed in the House during the debate of 22nd November. During the short time that I have been in Northern Ireland the impression I have received—obviously, it can be no more than an impression—confirms that.

The devolution order contains two provisions. The first provides that the date of devolution will be 13 days after the date upon which Her Majesty has made the order. Subject to the view of the House, it is intended to make the order on 19th December, and the date of the devolution will, therefore, be 1st January 1974.

The second provision sets out what are to be transferred matters on which the Assembly may legislate. It puts into the "transferred" category a maximum possible number of matters. Section 2(2) of the Constitution Act says that the devolution order may not declare any of the matters set out in Schedules 2 or 3 of the Act to be transferred matters. As the House will see, the order does in fact declare to be transferred matters all matters except those which are set out in Schedules 2 and 3.

The provisions of the order are short and simple but, in fact, the order marks the end of direct rule in Northern Ireland, and the coming into force of the new machinery of devolved government in Northern Ireland.

In the course of a debate last week, hon. Members from both sides of the House asked for further explanation of the financial arrangements between London and Northern Ireland. Naturally, I welcome public debate and discussion on these important matters, for they should be understood not only by parliamentarians but by the public. But I want to be as helpful to the House as possible without burdening it with a long and detailed explanation. The Government, therefore, accept that there is a need for a White Paper—as the hon. Member for Leeds, South (Mr. Merlyn Rees) suggested—describing the financial arrangements after devolution. Such a paper could, clearly, not be ready for today's debate, but it will be forthcoming. I cannot give a date, but I hope that what I have said will meet the hon. Gentleman's request.

This, of course, is only one aspect of the machinery of government in Northern Ireland after devolution. The major points about this machinery were discussed during the passage of the Northern Ireland Constitution Bill in the summer. The devolution order does not of itself make any such changes; it is the final step in the process which sets off the provisions in the Northern Ireland Constitution Act passed by Parliament.

I come now to the Northern Ireland (Modification of Enactments—No. 1) Order. The Constitution Act laid down those functions which after devolution will be excepted or reserved, but it was not possible within the compass of that Act to make the amendments to the law of Northern Ireland and of the United Kingdom required to give effect to this. It is, therefore, now necessary to amend existing United Kingdom and Northern Ireland law to take account of these decisions in the Constitution Act, and this is done by the Northern Ireland (Modification of Enactments—No. 1) Order. In particular, it provides for functions in the field of law and order, including judicial appointments, to be carried out in future by Her Majesty, the Lord Chancellor and the Secretary of State. It also provides for the United Kingdom finance departments to collect the duties and taxes which have become excepted. The order also makes various other changes required by the Constitution Act; for example, in matters to do with the electoral law.

Finally, I come to the order to which my hon. Friend the Member for Belfast, East (Mr. McMaster) referred. The Ministries (Northern Ireland) Order will create two new Ministries in Northern Ireland—the Ministry of the Environment and the Ministry of Manpower Services—which, like the other Ministries, will become Departments on 1st January. These changes are required to bring the pattern of Northern Ireland Ministries into line with that agreed between the three Northern Ireland parties and announced to this House by my right hon. Friend on 22nd November.

If the House agrees to the Bill and the orders, the effect will be to bring the whole new structure into operation. It has been a long and difficult struggle to get this far. The creation of a new system in any organisation is usually complicated, but especially so in the constitutional field. It is even more complicated in Northern Ireland because of its history. But it has been achieved, and the laurels go not only to my predecessor and his ministerial team but also to the hon. Member for Leeds, South and his colleagues, including, of course, the hon. Member for Salford, West (Mr. Orme), in the highly responsible approach they have consistently made to this issue; and last, but very far from least, to those politicians of Northern Ireland who have shown exceptional courage and wisdom in the way they have tackled their task. After all, it is even harder for them than for us. Let us remember the real dangers they face.

Having got the new system, we now have to make it work. For my part, I shall spare no effort, but it is a job to which every one of us can contribute. Some may try to wreck it. Before anyone embarks on that course, I hope he or she will ponder the possible consequences. The agony of the Province in recent years and the suffering of its people are too awful to permit any attitude now other than a determination to make the new arrangements work. Throughout these difficult years, it has always been said that a solution lay in a two-pronged approach: a vigorous onslaught against the terrorists, coupled with political advance. That political advance will shortly be a reality, and it must be the earnest hope, desire and, indeed, expectation that everyone will now give the new constitution the chance it truly deserves and stand up straight for Northern Ireland.