I will deal with the difficulties of the risk of avoidance, but I was dealing with the Government's failure to carry out a promise which the Chancellor of the Exchequer made at the time of a Budget speech that he would bring forward proposals dealing with the whole issue. He has not done so. That is the simple point which I am making. If that had been done, we could have had a proper scheme which we could have examined, with all the relevant points before us.

12.15 a.m.

As to the question of avoidance, I was not all that impressed by what the Financial Secretary said. I may not have followed his argument completely, but the challenge he put against the scheme proposed by the hon. Member for Crosby was that it opened the door to avoidance. It seems to me that that would apply not only under the hon. Gentleman's proposal but under the existing tax law. There is very little to prevent some of these things happening now. I may not have followed the hon. Gentleman's argument completely, but that is how it appears to me. However, that is a minor point. The major point is that we have had no proposals such as we were entitled to expect from the Government.

It is no sufficient answer to say that we have not got Government legislation on this and we do not know precisely what we should be catering for. We were promised Government legislation, but the Government changed their mind, being pushed away from the idea by the action or attitude of employers. If we have not yet got Government legislation and, every time they come near to proposing something, they run away from it, there will be a long time before we have satisfactory Government legislation with regard to severance payments and redundancy payments generally, and we shall never have a satisfactory arrangement in relation to the tax aspect of the matter.

Private schemes are affected. Private schemes are going ahead all the time. Negotiations are taking place between employers and trade unions representing employees, and many employers are alleging that the existing state of the tax law is a deterrent to working out a satisfactory scheme. Therefore, so far as there are private schemes going on, something ought to have been done.

No one will attempt to usurp the right of the hon. Member for Crosby in saying what he wants done about this particular Clause. I only say that I agree with the Financial Secretary that it was very helpful that the matter should be aired and brought before us. It is a pity that the debate came on so late, but it has been well worth considering. I am sorry that the Government are not ready to come forward with a definite proposal.