Clause 1. — (Removal of restrictions on amount of special Greenwich Hospital pensions and of expenditure on education and maintenance of children.)

Part of Orders of the Day — Pensions (Increase) Bill – in the House of Commons am 12:00 am ar 23 Ionawr 1947.

Danfonwch hysbysiad imi am ddadleuon fel hyn

Photo of Mr John Dugdale Mr John Dugdale , West Bromwich 12:00, 23 Ionawr 1947

I am afraid that I cannot accept this Amendment. I am interested in what seems to me to be a change of front on the part of the Opposition. I understood they were perfectly happy about the original Bill, but evidently the hon. and gallant Member for New Forest (Colonel Crosthwaite-Eyre) has occupied the Recess to some purpose and has discovered a number of important points which he has raised. To take the first one, the main object, at any rate of this part of the Bill, was to remove any limit. The amount fixed in 1869, and the amount fixed when it was altered later, was in fact a perfectly proper amount at that time. I am not saying that the amount suggested by the hon. and gallant Member for New Forest is not a perfectly proper amount now, but it may well be that in future years this amount may seem as improper as the amount suggested at an earlier date seems improper now. Therefore, we do not want to tie ourselves to any definite sum. I would like to emphasise that there is very full control over the administration of this fund.

First, there is Ministerial control. That may not mean very much perhaps to hon. Members opposite, but I would add that there is also Parliamentary control in so far as the sums which we propose to give, the limits that we propose, will be brought in as Orders in Council and paced on the Table of the House. Hon. Members will be able to see, from time to time, what in fact we are proposing to do and to question our action. Further than that, the Comptroller and Auditor-General's Department exercise very strict control over the pensions, over the details as well as the principle. Finally, I would refer to the point mentioned by the hon. and gallant Gentleman about these being private funds. That is a very important point. However, I would like to remind him that the control exercised over this fund is considerably greater than the control exercised over large numbers of other private funds. For example, I need take only the Royal Naval Benevolent Trust. The control which I have described and which will be exercised over the administration of the Greenwich Hospital Fund, will be considerably greater than that exercised over this and many other private funds. I think hon. Members can rest satisfied that the control will be adequate and that Parliament will have an opportunity, whenever it wants, of questioning our expenditure and seeing that, in fact, we are administering this fund properly. With that assurance, I hope the hon. and gallant Member will withdraw the Amendment.