Mr. SHIN WELL:

I hope that the right hon. Gentleman will not truckle to the other place in this matter, more particularly in respect of the de-rating of unworked minerals. Before dealing with that matter I would point out that we welcome very gladly the provision in respect of the de-rating of one-man businesses. Might I remind the right hon. Gentleman that some time ago I asked him a question on this matter. I wanted to know whether it was possible to extend the de-rating provisions to agricultural blacksmiths, and his answer was that it must be left to the assessors to decide. That view was not accepted gladly by hon. Members in many quarters of the House. We were concerned about the agricultural blacksmiths and about the men who were engaged in businesses in which they did not employ anyone, but the right hon. Gentleman stuck to his guns and whenever the point was put to him he replied, in the same terms, that that point must be determined eventually by the assessors. At what stage he decided to change his mind I cannot say but, apparently, some submissions must have been made to him, and in response he has induced the other place to provide this Amendment.

I have indicated that there is some difficulty on these benches as to how we should vote on this new Clause, because we accept the Amendment in regard to the one-man business, but it would appear to me that we have no alternative, in spite of our views regarding the derating of the one-man business, but to oppose the Clause as a whole. When the de-rating proposals were before the House, figures were submitted to us in respect of the cost to the Nation, through the Imperial Exchequer, and to the local authorities. To-day, although there is to be an amplification of the de-rating proposals, not a word has been said as to the cost involved. The right hon. Gentleman ought to tell us what it will cost the Imperial Exchequer and the local authorities to institute the extension of the de-rating proposals to one-man businesses, and he ought to tell us what it will cost as regards the extension to net and cruive salmon fishing, also, what it will cost as regards the minerals which are left unworked. So far as I know, the local authorities are in the dark. Whether their views have been sought, I cannot say, and it would be very interesting to know. Did the right hon. Gentleman consult the local authorities concerned, before he submitted this Amendment to the other place, and has he any figures to give to the House in relation to that point? I shall gladly await that information, and I think I reflect the opinion of other hon. Members on these benches and, possibly, the opinions of other hon. Members who are concerned about the financial provisions of de-rating and the welfare of local authorities, when I say that the information will be gladly received.

I come to the de-rating proposal in respect of salmon fishing. We have been told that they apply to commercial salmon fishing. That is quite proper, because, it ought not to apply to salmon fishing for sport alone. Is it possible for the right hon. Genetleman to say how it will be apportioned? Will the de-rating proposals in respect of salmon fishing go to the salmon fishers or to the owners of the waters? The Lord Advocate-I am sure that every person in the House will be glad to welcome him in his new position, although I cannot say that we hope he will occupy it for long; of course, that is a political matter—did not say anything on this head. I wonder whether he could inform us how this determination and allocation is to be made? Clearly if this relief is to be afforded to owners of the waters it is not going to be of much value to the salmon fishers on the commercial side. On that point again we are anxious for information.

My last point relates to the minerals let but unworked. It is perfectly true that in Scotland unworked minerals are assessed, and it is also true, with great respect to the hon. Member for Spring-burn (Mr. Hardie), that when arrangements are made between the owners of minerals and the coal owners, and a price is fixed for every ton of coal to be produced, a round figure is agreed upon for the working of coal in a potential sense. That is true, but what we want to know is how this possibly can affect productive industries in Scotland. We were told that de-rating would have the effect of improving the position of productive undertakings, and that coal was to be included, but to provide a larger measure of relief for those who are the owners of unworked minerals surely cannot affect in any useful or efficient way productive undertakings in Scotland. I submit that the Secretary of State should not accept this Amendment. He should have confined himself to the point of great substance—namely, the one man businesses, and have left the other things alone.

The hon. Member for Orkney and Shetland (Sir R. Hamilton) has quite rightly put the point as to whether the de-rating proposals in respect of one man businesses would affect a large circle in Scotland; whether it would affect the weaver and the woman who knits things at home for sale on the market, as it intended to affect the agricultural blacksmith and agricultural joiner. There must be a large number of persons in Scotland who work at home and in small establishments who do not employ any person or persons. It would be desirable if the right hon. Gentleman could tell us to whom this is to apply. It will not be sufficient for his purpose or for ours to say that the point must be eventually determined by the assessors. He has said that before, and he should now be in a position to tell us quite plainly, so that everybody in Scotland who is concerned may understand, to whom it is to apply. Clearly, if it is to be left to the assessors to determine we are going to have extensive litigation in Scotland. Litigation may be a desirable thing for those who can afford it; the Lord Advocate knows that it is profitable to gentlemen like himself but it is certainly not going to be profitable to the poor crofter and the poor agricultural blacksmith and agricultural joiner and persons who are experiencing a hard time in their endeavour to make ends meet. I hope the right hon. Gentleman will give the House further information on these points.