They may not have the credit, but they have an enormously increased productive capacity, and the fact that they have not the credit at the moment is not going to prevent them from being formidable competitors in future. If they are able to produce more cheaply than we are, and to make more profit out of their production, the credit will come to them, and they will have no difficulty in obtaining the necessary credit, other things being equal—I mean, political conditions being stable. I do not want to be deflected from my main proposition, though I felt that I must answer the point put from such an authoritative source by my hon. Friend the Member for Ilford (Sir F. Wise).

It is agreed that in these countries you have this enormously increased capacity for production, and the first thing that happens when you restore Europe will be increased production. Increased consumption will follow somewhat behind. If we take the iron and steel trade, should I be wrong if I said that the capacity of Europe to-day to produce was 50 per cent. or 75 per cent. or 100 per cent. more than the capacity of the world to absorb at the present time? That means that, as you restore Europe, you will find concurrently with it this greater productive capacity and far keener competition. That means that you have to look for trade not only there but elsewhere. I do not want to anticipate the debate which we shall necessarily have, and a debate which I wish and still hope may be taken without party bias. Surely, the market which lies open to us is the market within our own Empire. If one goes back over history, one finds that in the most critical time through which our industry passed, long before the present crisis, namely, between 1875 and 1895, when for years our foreign trade remained absolutely at a standstill, the one thing that kept the increasing population of this country going was that our Empire trade doubled during those 15 or 20 years.

You have the same opportunity to-day. What has been said about the American debt makes it all the more important to try to develop the new markets in the Empire. We do not want a Committee to go into that. You have the work of the Imperial Economic Conference. I do hope, particularly in view of something which I have seen in the papers of one of the internal organisations of the right hon. Gentleman's party, that he may reconsider the rather hasty decision not to proceed with the appointment of an Imperial Economic Committee. That seems to me the best way to carry out the inquiry which my hon. Friend suggests. I venture, as an older Member, to congratulate sincerely the hon. Member for East Leyton (Major Church) on the speech which he delivered. I understand it is not a maiden speech, and I only wish that I had heard him make earlier speeches if they were of an equal quality. But the second factor which I would lay down is that the most important requirement in order to get efficiency is to give security. The hon. Member said that you want more money spent on research. You do. But let him and his friends remember that to get money sunk in research, the one thing above all necessary is to afford security and the full sense security to firms in order that they may make their investments on that account. Under the Board of Trade, in conjunction with the Department of Scientific Research, you can probably render such help as a Government can give. If the Government co-operate in promoting the spending of money on such processes of inquiry, I believe that they will be spending money to great advantage.

10.0 P.M.

The third factor which I would lay down when considering how to fill up the gap in our export trade is the question of cost. Here I believe that a real inquiry is wanted. I doubt whether an inquiry into the incidence of taxation is going to add very much to our knowledge. I would like to see an inquiry directed into the difference in wages in what have been called the sheltered and unsheltered trades and the causes of those differences, and the effect of those differences in adding to the cost of the unsheltered trades and reducing the wages in those trades, and making it more difficult for us to compete in the world. Remember it is the unsheltered trades which have to sell the products which buy the food on which the sheltered and unsheltered trades live. That inquiry, I am sure, is included in the intention of the Motion. I should like to see coupled with it an investigation into the comparative incidence of these charges on the business and trades of this country and other countries. Further, in that connection, let us look into that great and important item in overhead charges, the cost of taxation, whether direct, or indirect—and in taxation I include all national expenditure and rates—and let us know what is the effect of that charge upon the competitive trades in this country as compared with costs which fall upon similar trades in other countries.

I believe that an inquiry of that kind into the competitive costs and what gives rise to those costs, and the incidence of those costs, would be of value, because they would supply us with what an inquiry ought to be directed to, accurate information, which we have not at present, upon which we can base policy and decide what action it is right to take. If the inquiry took that form I should welcome it. I do not think it necessary to bring in a High Court Judge. The only inquiry for which we want to take a High Court Judge away from his judicial duties is an inquiry in which he would have judicial duties to perform. You could get men of practical experience and economic experience, not confined to Members of this House, to conduct an inquiry of this kind, and I believe that it would be a real contribution to our knowledge of this subject and of real assistance to the trade of this country.